Loki and Sylvie have had enough of being told who to be, their lives lost in the shadow of the supposedly Sacred Timeline. They’ve fought through twists, turns, betrayals, apocalypses, their very selves, and even world consuming monsters at the dumping grounds of all variant timelines. They’ve pulled every last trick in their arsenal to make their way to the Citadel at the End of Time to break free of Destiny’s chains, once and for all. All that’s left…is He Who Remains.
Spoiler Warning: We go in depth fairly regularly in all of our episodes, but in this case, big spoilers come in pretty early, so we figured an extra spoiler warning couldn’t hurt. Major spoilers follow!
You have been warned.
(Ed. note: Before you check this one out, go read last weeks write up here.)
Armaan Babu: Never have I been so thrilled with an episode that’s left me so unsatisfied. The MCU’s just given us its biggest cliffhanger since Avengers: Infinity War. This is less of a satisfying conclusion to a brilliantly written series than it is a springboard for Season 2 – and, possibly, the future of the MCU as a whole. Joining me for his second MCU TV series finale coverage is Battle of the Atom co-host, Adam Reck! Welcome, Adam – how have you been enjoying the series so far, and what did you think of this episode in particular?
Adam Reck: Hi Armaan, thank you for having me onboard! Frankly I think this is by far the best of the three Disney+ MCU series so far. It feels cohesive and expensive from its set designs and costumes all the way down to its warbly soundtrack. And I am a sucker for a time travel story, so the fact that Loki has not just been bouncing around with another Loki but encountering multiple Lokis in a quest to discover who controls time in the MCU? I have been locked in since episode one. And this finale did not disappoint! It jumps right back in after Loki & Sylvie were able to defeat the Alioth cloud and are about to come face to face with a whole new era for the MCU.
He Who Remains…For Now
Armaan: So on the whole, not a lot actually happens in this episode. What does happen is major, so I’m glad the episode has the time to let things breathe. To that end, we have our increasingly sinister TVA mascot heading off Loki and Sylvie’s attempts to meet the man behind the curtain at the Citadel at the End of Time. Miss Minutes offers both of them a devil’s bargain – give up their pursuit of He Who Remains, and the TVA’ll set ‘em up a nice cosy timeline, even rearrange reality enough to allow both of them to exist, together.
What interests me here is that Miss Minutes’ offer shows a fundamental misunderstanding of who both these characters have become – yet, just enough of an understanding of them for both Loki and Sylvie to be pained by this temptation.
As Loki himself told Sylvie last episode, he’s not the same person he was when this all started. The illusion of glorious purpose is something he’s seen past. He even wryly joked about the idea that conquering worlds would make him happy. For the first time in perhaps any of his lives, he’s aware that happiness isn’t to be found in a throne – something that’s going to be important, later.
Sylvie, on the other hand, is on the exact opposite side of healthy goals. She doesn’t want a blissful life together with the man she loves (more on THAT later!) – she wants revenge. She wants to meet the man who made her life a living hell and she wants to stab her dagger through his chest.
Loki is a show with a lot of faith in its actors. The writing alone would have made this a rote, forgettable moment, but Tom Hiddleston and Sophia di Martino both give this last temptation a lot of weight to it. It mingles with the music in the most gorgeous of ways – the theme here is one we first encountered when Loki was looking at the futility of his life on the Sacred Timeline. It evokes their Norse heritage, and their Frost Giant heritage – it’s a musical riff that evokes a cold wind that blows through your soul. More than that, though…it’s a wind that feels hollow. It’s a note of regret. An entire life, an entire timeline that just wasn’t enough, and the cold, hollow weight of that.
This was Kang’s episode, for sure. But this moment is one I’m going to be thinking a lot about in the wait for Season 2.
Adam: What a beautiful distillation of these performances! When Miss Minutes popped up, I was like, “Oh hell yes, Miss Minutes is the villain!” I was laughing so hard because there have been so many people on Twitter joking about Miss Minutes being evil, and here is this cartoon, who has been noticeably obstructive since the last episode, providing this last chance escape for our heroes.
Speaking of social media, I feel like so much of the anticipation of what was in this castle was weighed by fans theorizing over the last few weeks. Knowing that Jonathan Majors had been cast as Kang in Ant-Man 3: Quantumania I think the odds were high that it was going to be Kang, but large portions of fandom also expected Mephisto to pop up in the final episode of Wandavision, so it wasn’t a done deal by any stretch. I’d seen theories that time was controlled by another Loki, and some more outlandish ideas, so the fact that they were willing to not only drop Jonathon Majors into this last episode, but allow him to dominate the final episode with an impressive monologue was a bold move that will make this episode memorable for a long time.
A Council of Reeds, I Mean, Kangs
Adam: So let’s get into this monologue, because after a short trip in an elevator, it is Mr. Majors’ show now and boy do we get a hell of a performance. Dude is just chewing the scenery, and he never even says his name! What we do get is an illustrated history lesson of multiversal Kangs, which reminded me so much of Jonathan Hickman’s Council of Reeds from his Fantastic Four run, and we even saw multiple little Kangs dressed in the Kang costume! And of course this Kang is a good one who’s just trying to keep all those other Kangs from Kanging across the multiverse. That is . . . if we believe him? Armaan, what did you think of the rambling, showstopping storytelling of “He Who Remains?”
Armaan: Like I said, this show puts a lot of faith in its actors, and nowhere is that clearer than it is here. Given the cliffhanger nature of this episode, can you imagine how maddening it would be if this much screen time was given to pure exposition if a less charismatic actor had been cast?
I will admit, while I was certain enough Kang would appear to make a cookie bet with my brother (who owes me cookies now. Rejoice, internet!), I was expecting a cameo. Or a short scene that quickly pivoted back to Loki and Sylvie’s stories. Even something as small as a post-credits scene – certainly not this!
I do like this version of Kang, and I feel like “this version” is important to specify, because as he pointed out – there are a lot of Kangs! The one we meet is less Kang the Conqueror and more Kang the Desperate Scientist Who Makes Hard Choices. It’s a fascinating story, one I want to believe and, for the moment, am choosing to.
What’s interesting is how closely Kang’s story mirrors the propaganda Miss Minutes gave us way back in Episode 1. The purpose of the TVA really is to prevent multiversal war. The only lie is that the agents aren’t created – they’re just brainwashed variants. Kang could have easily told them all the full truth, collected variants who are given a choice to serve or be pruned from existence. Instead, he rewrote all their minds as a shortcut to their undying loyalty – and that says almost as much about Kang as his entire monologue.
Adam: You’re making an excellent point about this version of Kang. Majors is playing him as mad scientist here, so it will be exciting to see the various versions of him that will emerge, just like seeing the various versions of Loki have been. But it’s important to note that this version of Kang already feels like it will be a significant departure from the version we see in the 616. Comic book Kang is relatively stoic and occasionally stale. We know he likes messing with time, but not always why. And unlike other MCU interpretations that play things way too safe, this actually feels like a bit of a risk! You also mentioned the TVA. I don’t know that even this Kang would describe what he’s doing as borderline ethical. He knows he’s doing wrong, but he is convinced it’s for the right reasons. It’s a dubious distinction, but as acceptable evils go, it looks like we’re going to find out if he was right as the story continues. But since you brought up the TVA, we should probably check in on Mobius, Judge Renslayer and the recently converted B-15.
Back at the TVA
Armaan: The most scathing line in this entire series has been Mobius telling Loki he’s a bad friend, and those two just met! Revonna and Mobius have been friends and co-workers for a long, long time – and she’s been a very bad friend.
While Hunter B-15 lures TVA agents to Freemont, Ohi to reveal that the original Revonna is just some high school teacher – a deeply anticlimactic departure from her comic-book counterpart of a princess from a future empire – Mobius and Renslayer have their own heart to heart about who betrayed who.
As I noted last episode, the main difference between the two seems to be that Revonna is dedicated to the organization, while Mobius is dedicated to the cause. Mobius probably would have gone along with Kang’s plan if he’d just been asked – but Revonna is someone who shows us just how hurtful Kang’s lies are. All she’s known is the structure of the TVA, and now that it’s crumbling around her, she’s terrified.
There’s also talk of free will – what did you think of this, Adam? How does free will work in a world where time travelers edit your story as they see fit?
Adam: I’ve been waiting for us to get to the meat of this. As someone who is obsessed with the concept of branching timelines and the existential quandaries surrounding choice of the illusion thereof, this entire season has been teasing the idea that an almighty individual was responsible for the deterministic single timeline for every event in the MCU, including our poor abductees in the TVA.
Now, this is fascinating because we’ve already seen The Avengers dabble in time travel in Endgame. Not only do they go back in time to retrieve the Infinity Stones, but they mess up and need to fix their mess by going even further back in time. Kang suggests that all of these actions were the only actions any of these characters could have taken. There was only an illusion of choice, as the timeline was already prescribed and results decided beforehand in service of the greater good. Even though The Avengers acted to stop a madman from killing half of all living things in the entire universe, this Kang is suggesting that the risk of inviting multiversal Kangs into the MCU is a bigger threat than anything we’ve seen before in 20+ films. And THAT is huge.
I think the other thing worth considering here is how choice and decision making will affect the future of the stories we’re going to see in the films to come. We already got a joke about the multiverse in Spider-Man: Far From Home, and given the inclusion of J.K. Simmons as J Jonah Jameson at that movie’s conclusion, there’s a great deal of speculation about the third Spider-Man film, No Way Home including multiversal contact of multiple Spideys and his villains. How this all links together remains to be seen, but the possibilities are huge. I couldn’t have been the only person immediately starting to think about Secret Wars as potential long-term goal down the line.
As far as short-term effects go, Loki ends up back at the TVA and well. . . things aren’t what they seem.
We’re All Villains Here
Armaan: One of the biggest flaws I saw in Kang’s reasoning is the idea that he’s inevitable. He has no faith in his own ability to change, in his own free will – he works to stop himself, at all costs. You’ll note that the Sacred Timeline hasn’t stopped war, galactic or otherwise. Like most Lokis, the only thing Kang seems to care about is himself.
He puts a lot of faith in the assumption that if time’s allowed to branch out again, his other selves will cause war. That given the choice, Kang will always cause war, which is why he’s so sure that killing him will make no difference whatsoever. He doesn’t give himself the benefit of the doubt. I mean, sure, it turns out he’s right, but that doesn’t mean he’s…y’know, right. Stripping people of their free will in a desperate bid to keep them contained…hurting people because he believes he has to…Kang may not be a Loki variant, but the two certainly have a lot in common.
Adam: There’s an irony in Kang’s belief in his multiversal selves inevitable warring, since we just saw the multiversal Lokis at war with each other in the previous episode. Not to mention that Sylvie and Loki, despite demonstrating their love for each other, still end up at each other’s throats because Sylvie will not be denied her revenge.
Armaan: Sylvie is not someone who’s learned to give people the benefit of the doubt. Loki took Sylvie’s “This isn’t about you” to heart – he recognizes that the choice to be made here is bigger than himself. Sylvie, however, sees only one thing: her need for vengeance. Even though her love for Loki’s made surprisingly explicit with an onscreen kiss (something I’ve been shipping since Episode 3), she’s not going to allow anything to get in the way of her quest. She stabs Kang through the chest, and the universe diverges.
Adam: It was exhilarating to see the ring of time branch off into a thick cloud of threads, Each one its own What If?
Armaan: We have little idea of what this means, or of how this changes things, besides two points: Mobius has never met Loki, doesn’t even recognize him, and the new TVA? No lies about Timekeepers; it’s Kang who’s in charge.
Season 2 & Quantumania!
Armaan: For all the reasons you’ve listed earlier, I almost wish we hadn’t had an announcement for Loki Season 2. There’s an (unsubstantiated) rumor that Loki was meant to be a longer series, but the pandemic split it in two. That means it’s entirely possible that this show’s revelations can be contained in Loki and Ant-Man: Quantumania.
I would be excited if this wasn’t the case. You’re right, you’re not the only person who feels Marvel might be gearing up for Secret Wars, possibly in Phase 6. If Kang’s the new villain, versions of him could be appearing everywhere – in Doctor Strange’s mad multiverse, in Spider-Man, he was even the first real villain in the Young Avengers comic, a property that Marvel has been slowly building up in the background. The scope for this Season’s cliffhanger is amazing, and it’s the most thrilled I’ve been for the MCU since the moment I first saw Thanos onscreen.
Adam: I’d be fascinated to know the behind the scenes story of how the pandemic affected this production. It had a much more obvious effect on Falcon and the Winter Soldier with reused sets (and they never sailed that damn boat!), whereas here it felt like we got a season cliffhanger that was maybe meant to be an episode cliffhanger? Obviously we don’t know what went into the decision making process, but the end does feel abrupt for not having a next chapter in the story next week.
Armaan: On the other hand, this episode swept Loki and Sylvie’s stories aside completely – and if I have to choose between the MCU widening is scope to an astounding degree, or Loki and Sylvie getting a fully fleshed out, satisfying end to their story by bringing the focus back to them, I’m going to choose the latter, every time.
Hopefully, we can have both.
Timely Variant Afterthoughts
- Whether or not it was intentional, Kang’s use of the apple is a fun callback to the first time we see time manipulation in the MCU: Doctor Strange replenishing a half-eaten apple to test out the Time Stone. It even looked like the apple replenished itself a few times offscreen – and as an added bonus, the apple’s green, like the Time Stone itself.
- The branching timelines look for all the world like a nervous system. It might just be what curvy timelines branching out looks like, but the idea of the Multiverse as an organism is an exciting one.
- Loki and Sylvie’s body language mirrored each other a LOT this episode. They may be separate people, but they have similar responses to threats, it looks like.
- There were a lot of standout moments in Kang’s performance, but the intermingled fear and excitement of passing that threshold and not knowing what was coming next was brilliantly performed.
- Props to the audio engineers who built the amazing collection of sound clips used to start the episode. And props to the inevitable nerds who identify the scenes that each one comes from.
- I knew this story wasn’t over when Mobius didn’t get his jet ski. Get that man his jet ski!
- Get that man his jet ski!
Armaan is obsessed with the way stories are told. From video games to theater, TTRPGs to comics, he has written for, and about, them all. He will not stop, actually; believe us, we've tried.
Adam Reck is the cartoonist behind Bish & Jubez as well as the co-host of Battle Of The Atom.
